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Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

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Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby ngc7293 » Fri Mar 24, 2017 6:22 am

So, I was making a Zen archer Monk. I got to 6th level when I noticed it. Perfect Strike is listed twice, once as a feat and once as a special ability. I saw it first as the feat when it was showing the weapons supported. (the special ability supports the bow only and the feat only certain monk weapons). So I was confused until I started viewing the character as different output sheets and seeing that there were two Perfect Strikes.

I am wondering if this was intended for a regular monk wanting to take Perfect Strike.
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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby Distant Scholar » Fri Mar 24, 2017 6:01 pm

As I understand it, the Perfect Strike ability gives the zen archer the Perfect Strike feat. It *also* allows the zen archer to use the feat with any bow. It *also* allows the zen archer to roll 3 dice once the zen archer reaches 10th level (monk).


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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby ngc7293 » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:36 am

You have it as it is SUPPOSED to work. I didn't test this three different ways and on two different versions before I posted. It was late. (It's late again) I made the Zen Archer with as few books as needed. I think I was using 6.06.01.

Under Feats it shows Perfect strike. The character is level 6. I didn't choose the Perfect Strike feat at any time.
As you said, Perfect Strike is a free feat given to the Zen Archer at first level. It even shows up in the Special Abilities section as such.

This is what I am talking about.
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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby Distant Scholar » Sat Mar 25, 2017 12:39 pm

I guess I'm not sure what the problem is, then.


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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby Nylanfs » Sat Mar 25, 2017 1:42 pm

He's seeing Perfect Strike twice, which is "technically" correct because they are different but not useful.


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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby LegacyKing » Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:25 pm

The class feature is listed under the Special Qualities, the result of the class feature is the granting of the feat of the same name. This is working as intended. PCGen doesn't control the naming of Class Features, but I'm guessing if they had given it a better name like "Path of the Perfect Strike" we wouldn't be discussing the duplicated name...


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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby ngc7293 » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:12 pm

I think you have said it before that you Code for the Rules. But couldn't you change the name of the Monk version of Perfect Strike to something like "Zen - Perfect Strike" to differentiate it from the actual feat? I am not sure how the coding works, but something behind the scenes so that they both look the same but the Zen Archer one and the Feat one look the same but they are different.
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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby LegacyKing » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:40 pm

I'm thinking this is a very small nitpick here. But the answer is no. I am bound by licensing agreements. We cannot alter the names of the publishers' stuff. We code up (to the best of our ability) the exact names, and items the publisher presents. It is not our place to correct their naming, or alter their wording. If they release an errata, or update their book, then we will follow suit. But this is not a call we unilaterally make. The OGL is fairly specific, and the agreements our Publisher Liaison makes with the various publishers must be followed. And yes, we have an actual agreement on file for Paizo Publishing, Inc. which allows us to use their IP names for certain objects.

The Class Feature from the Book:

Perfect Strike (Ex): At 1st level, a zen archer gains
Perfect Strike as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet
the prerequisites. A zen archer can use Perfect Strike with
any bow. At 10th level, the monk can roll his attack roll
three times and take the highest result. If one of these
rolls is a critical threat, the monk must choose one of
his other two rolls to use as his confirmation roll. This
ability replaces Stunning Fist.


That means the Name of the Class Feature is "Perfect Strike (Ex)". The character sheet displays FEATS and CLASS FEATURES in two different locations.

You need to talk to Paizo, it's their written material. We are not the publisher, we do not control how the publisher presents their materials. I do know that the class features are all listed under Special Quality (Which one day, when I have the free time available, I will rename that block to Class Features)... If you want me to sort the Class Features by Class Name, and Level gained, then certainly that is easy and you can make a request. Display issues of that nature are up to us. Renaming items is a no-no, since we have to reference that item and calling it something else is confusing.

Cheers,


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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby LegacyKing » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:43 pm

Just a quick follow up - Are you asking me to create an entirely new Feat called Zen - Perfect Strike?

Or are you asking that we add the Zen Archer extras to be displayed in the feat?

Cause my above post, it sounds like you're complaining about the Class Feature and Feat sharing the same name.


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Re: Zen Archer - Perfect Strike, not so perfect

Postby LegacyKing » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:48 pm

And a follow up to that. Zen Archer doesn't have a different feat. It gains the feat called Perfect Strike. The class feature adds exceptions to that EXISTING feat. Behind the scene and publicly facing there is only ONE feat.

So, by the coding - The Class Feature Perfect Strike, grants a feat Called Perfect Strike. That's it. Perfect Strike is the one any character can pick up. The Class feature then grants exceptions to the feat in its usage. The class is not creating a new feat, just modifying how the Archetype may use that feat.


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